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My shop for some odd reason was the target of one of the griefers' attacks. Does anyone know what this groups' agenda is? I mean, are they griefing just to be smacktards or are they trying to make some sort of statement or point? Either way, I don't much care; I'm just curious why they'd grief rather than actually using WORDS to get their message across to people, that is, if they even have a point to all this.

For the most part I mind my own damned business. I don't go out of my way to express my opinions; I design in SL, it does my art-business-creativity-learning experience no good to be involved in the pissy politics of this little community. However, today I had an event going on that had taken weeks of planning and the contribution of a lot of time from some really gifted, enthusiastic people, and it was happening without a hitch. I had a sim full of people and was able to show off the work of a lot of very talented new designers-artists to several people when the idiots with the talking peepees showed up. Whatever W-Hats' agenda is, it apparently does not include the fostering and encouragement of new talent in this venue, nor does it include actually talking to people who might take the time to listen to their viewpoints. Congratulations, children, you're now classified as 'intellectually challenged knuckle-draggers' in my humble opinion, and have lost any chance whatsoever to educate me in whatever agenda you might have had. From now on, I will go -out of my way- to take stands diametrically opposed to anything you're involved in.

Happy now?

Prokofy Neva

I haven't taken a lot of time to study W-HAT but I have this vague sense that they are British soccer aggro types or German anarchists or something -- they have that feel of hate-America Euro-conceptual art about them. Or who knows, maybe they're Australian, or maybe they're from Peoria. I'm just describing the feel from the W-HAT oeuvre as it were.

My main experience of them has been as event-wreckers. Once, I too, spent a fair amount of time preparing a job fair with recruiters and job seekers, and we were all struggling to talk, use the cumbersome notecarding equipment in SL, etc. when the W-Hatters arrived en masse and began heckling, pretending to seek jobs as the World Trade Center, pushing people, flying around etc. It took a lot of effort to click on them all and freeze and eject them, and in the course of doing that, I ejected a wanted guest by mistake.

A lot of their actions have centered around the World Trade Center and 9/11 mainly for its shock and anger value and I guess the message we're all supposed to absorb from these asshats (the word from which I think their name must be taken) is that the U.S. is too self-centered in mourning this terrorist attack or too self-preoccupied or that is itself a terrorist power for starting wars blah blah blah the end. The usual uninformed hysterical Chomskyian mine-meme dreck. As you point out, they don't educate, they don't even bludgeon to death with some coherent point of view, they just annoy, like a very badly acted version of something that is supposed to be like a kewl German avant-garde happening kinda thing.
Even those willing to tolerate them wish their satire was more funny and on point.

One thing they achieved was to drive the player base further into the arms of LL, remaining uncritical on the eve of 1.7 as they remove the Leader Boards, the classifieds in the forums, etc., and to get the player base also to draw all their wagons into a circle, regardless of their differences, to all join in a hate fest of the grid griefer.

I myself personally felt a rush of gratitude toward dedicated LL "grid monkeys" who worked for hours to restore the world, so that it was "still there" when I was able to log on. The idea that LL is "still there" when you turn it back on, unlike even a lot of things in RL that aren't "still there" for all kinds of reason, is one of its greatest charms.


Agreed. There are lots of things they -could- be focused on to make SL and indeed the preshuss metaverse a more expansive experience for all, but no. Seems to be all about them, they get attention but for no purpose, attention they could be getting to educate, or -something-. What they accomplish is -nothing-, a recurrent fact that keeps escaping their myopic little fields of vision.

Mulch Ennui

After a healthy review of the SA site, and seeing their antics, I think you all give them too much credit

they just like fucking with people

give them a reaction, any reaction, and they win

im sorry prok but I laffed outloud at the thought of a giant building chasing you around. I felt bad after i realized you live in NY, but still, it could have been a giant stay puft marshmallow man, the mental image of you lecturing them while they belched up beer soaked porkrinds is hilarious.

they just like fucking with people. I called them hooligans as well, but to them this is entertainment. peoples reactions are funnier to them than anything they did to initiate the reaction.

don't react. take away the incentive, and they will go to THERE

Prokofy Neva

They just like fucking with people, but they have a plan, and a pattern of behaviour, and tactics that are consistently used. They aren't just a bunch of happy-go-lucky pranksters. There's more method to it.

I'm glad you got a good laff out of the thought of the World Trade Center appearing as an avatar in a game chasing me around. Fuck you. I lost one of my jobs in this terrorist attack and the company suffered a terrible economic loss. My childrens' classmates lost their parents. Our parish, with all its Irish fire-fighters and insurance adjusters, lost way more than its share of neighbours and friends. So fuck you. I don't think it's appropriate that somebody dress up in a building and crash on to someone. No more appropriate than dressing up as a gas chamber and chasing Jews around. It's fucking sick. I'm happy to draw the line at where it becomes that if nobody else will.

I don't believe if chilling and not reacting to things like that. I believe in ejecting them from my land, abuse-reporting them, and hoping they are banned. Since Rotten Thatch, the perpetrator of that attack, is no longer in the list, and his attack was a repeated one and not only on me, it's a safe bet that he was banned.

He chose my event, and chose me, because he read the forums on some post about 9/11 and saw that not only did I live in NYC, I had some small personal loss associated with the attack. He then deliberately sought me out to try to humiliate and terrorize me. That's not just hacking around and being a hooligan. That's being a vindictive mindfucker with a sense of impunity and that kind of rabid force running around makes for the destruction of civilization.

Mulch Ennui

"im sorry prok but I laffed outloud at the thought of a giant building chasing you around. I felt bad after i realized you live in NY, but still, it could have been a giant stay puft marshmallow man,"

like i said, I apologize for laffing. no disrespect, seriously. they are button pushers. they push any button they know about. don't react, they think your button is broke and they move on. your reaction to me innocently laffing before i realised you were personally effected is just giving them more ammo. take away their ammo

" I believe in ejecting them from my land, abuse-reporting them, and hoping they are banned."

as you should. that is the correct way to deal with it, swiftly, silently, no reaction, let the authorities handle it

again i apologize for my temporary insensitivity, please understand I meant no offense to you. don't fall for their games. stocisim

Prokofy Neva

No, I don't believe in all that hippie-dippie be-here-now chill-man-like-feel-the-magic stuff is applicable to life, first or second. Everybody who tells you that you have "buttons" that can be "pushed" and tells you "not to let your buttons be pushed" are themselves behaving like superior assholes who can a) identify where your buttons are, like they are free of them themselves? and b) tell you airily that you shouldn't let your buttons be pushed.

I don't believe in hydraulic and mechanical explanations for human behaviour. Sure, on a keyboard, press "T," and "T" comes up.

People have different Ts, and some people are good at pressing the Ts. But that's fine. If someone presses this T on me, they get the full capital T. They get it in their face. I reject little silly hippie metaphors drawn from tired 1960s social theory and rhetoric (next minute you're going to be asking me what colour my parachute is and going up the down staircase). Someone pushes this T on me, I give them T out the kazoo. We need more of that in life.

The problem with W-HAT is that there hasn't been ENOUGH reaction. There's indifference, especially that urbane chilly little laughter that comes from the sophisticates who think it's about free expression and art and don't realize that IN and environment of freedom it's OK to pushback and using your own freedom of expression, CONDEMN IT ROBUSTLY.

Um, the Lindens can ban me from the forums

In fact, can't anybody see all the taunting going on now not only with people like Nauv deFarge, who is one of those loafers and griefers of SL who is close to, if not in, WHAT and how has been documented by me and others as griefing and loafing and sponging? Or with this new resident Natasha Sholokhov talking about bees in her bonnet? Please. Isn't this all pretty transparent as a destructive network bent on trying to paralyze civil society? It's ok to fight back.

It has nothing to do with my personal experience. The fact is, 9/11 was our nation's whole personal experience. Lots of people suffered big time -- and are still suffering. Nobody gets to play with that without a big pushback from me.

Mulch Ennui

funy, i was actully in the play up the down staircase in high school. btw, that play was set in the 50s. my group did it as 60s kids, but niether here nor there...

i apologized for insensitivity, you chose not to accept it, thats fine, the apology still stands

but, the bigger the T you type, the happier you make them. trust me, most of the "pranks" and games i have played in my life revolve around identify and applying pressure to buttons. you can say i am full of shit, i dont care

what matters to me is that it works. ask my gf about the guy who threatened to stalk and harass her for a dumbass gunfight in rausch. he was an officer of a "tuff guy" group. i told him she could handle herself (because to say "oh no!" would allow him to identify a possible weakness), and then i killed him, pissed on his ghost, sent him a pic of me pissing on him, and then threatened to send it to the entire membership list of his group so they could see how tuff he really was

we went apeshit, starting negging me and my gf on his alts, and is no longer in the game. gone banned, busted and defeated he left.

i identified and pushed his button


and if I wanted to fuck with you, you have given 100s of ways to fuck with you, things youy feel passionatly about and that represent your true ideals and core beleifs, that i could have you spitting on your moniter

i just don't do that. thats W-Hat shit. i'm a dope smoking hippie utopiast, I just want to hang out and enjoy the many facets of SL

My apology still stands, take it or don't, I mean it but I am not gonna debate you in your comments section all day.


"I lost one of my jobs in this terrorist attack and the company suffered a terrible economic loss. My childrens' classmates lost their parents. Our parish, with all its Irish fire-fighters and insurance adjusters, lost way more than its share of neighbours and friends. So fuck you."

As someone who actually lost a friend in the WTC attacks I get pretty tired of this shit. If you have been on an airplane out of Boston once, or have a friend of a neighbor of somebody who died in the attack, or maybe you saw some of the smoke from across the East River ... you don't get to throw the guilt attack at anybody, so fuck you. Mulch decided to apologize to you but he should have saved his sympathies for somebody who actually needed them.

I agree with you, LL should crack down on W-Hat early to prevent them from paralyzing civil society. They should have done it to YOU way earlier than they did, before you had your go at paralyzing civil society.

Prokofy Neva

I think it doesn't matter whether you have a low level of involvement or a high level involvement with the WTC and 9/11 and some kind of loss. It was a national tragedy. It's wrong to make a building symbolizing that tragedy, actually destroyed in that evil terrorist attack, and whack somebody over the head with it. It should be roundly condemned, and the person should be banned as much as they'd be banned for any kind of hate speech or racist speech. It's actually a PVP type of attack in any event in this case.

Mulch is trying to be more liberal than thou and tell everybody to shrug it off, and dispense hippie sage advice to let it roll off your back, peace, brother. Bullshit. It should be condemned, banned, booted.

There's nothing I've done that destroys civil society; indeed, the kind of dissent I've engaged in only helps to bring it about and preserve it. Group-think in the tekkie-wiki isn't civil on the SL forums, and isn't an open society, either.

Prokofy Neva

Um, I fail to see how killing and pissing on somebody isn't letting them push your buttons, to go by your silly ideology, which I don't buy anyway. Seems like a reaction, big-time.

Your threat to identify things I am passionate about and seek to fuck my mind over them is pretty empty, and any way, lets me know what kind of violent perso you are under all the hippie dope-smoking stuff -- which is so often how it is. Most things are not what they seem. Most things are just the opposite.

I don't accept apologies because they're not sincere. And you don't get to apologize because you learn some fresh detail of a RL incident, you shouldn't engage in such flippant remarks in the first place.


haha! no more neg ratting in 1.7. proky, how will you spend your precious time now?

Prokofy Neva

I have prepared myself for just such an occasion, and have already held events where I issued negrate certificates:

o ordinary white negrate certificate for just one negrate on one attribute
o golden trifecta negrate certificate for negrates on all three attributes
o special purple trifecta alt certificate for being negrated not only by my one account, but my alts (actually very rare)

I've issued these to deserving patrons of my negrates who requested them, and I may now issue them in lieu of the game's negrating capacity, I'm still pondering that.

If you had previously received a negrate from me and would like to commemorate this well-deserved experience, contact me for your certificate.

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