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02/27/2011

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Laetizia Coronet

I thought it was strange how Merkel declared 'multiculturalism' a failure. It's like declaring 'dayight' a failure.
Multiculturalism is a fact of modern European life. I lived between Poles, Turks, Moroccans, a lone Azeri immigrant, Surinamers and people from the Dutch Antilles in a poor working class quarter in Holland. That was no 'failure' - that was everyday reality (and it was actually a nice place to live).

Seen from a European perspective (at least my moderately Leftist one) Merkel was paying lip service to the strong, deeply disturbing wave of islamophobia taking hold in Europe, with ties to the likes of Pamela Geller. Merkel faces a new political party modelled after Geert Wilders' succesful Freedom Party in Holland - whose main and virtually only agenda point is to kick Islam out of Holland.

That's why she sang the tired old song of the right about 'multiculturalism'. Merkel's a politician, Prok. To paraphrase Deep Throat: "Just follow the votes".

c3

alot of "reality" in that post about the past of virtuality;)

As i state over at mediabastard I see myself as the bastard son of those mavens of the 1960s. roddenbery and mcluhan

I also know media history and grok all the shows (transmedias birth) mentioned..-- ROMPER ROOM btw- national licensed to be local:) and Mr Rodgers-- the surburban nice neignhor before John wayne Gacy, and eddie murphy redid him on SNL in 80s.:)

anyhow--as i mentioned, the ethnic diversity of my virtual piers (tv friends) did make me ignore the "shvartze" talk that was the reality of families sunday visits to brooklyn... so i credit that presentation of the world to me from 6-10 for that,,

also back then the "commercial sales" of Seasmem street products didnt exist-- 1980 brought the deregulation and the muppets as marketers of branded products, not just information-tools... i do think pre 1980 and post 1980 Childrent television workshop was very different "business"... not unlike TV news...

anyhow-- By 12 i found the idealism of "star trek"... IDIC.... Infintite diversity in infinite combinations.. a mix of logic and humanity... and a "philosophy" of equality -but in a paramilitary ordered world -assimlited humanity--just enough to get along-get shit done- - idealistic and fictional yes.. but it is good stuff for a teen..:) So much better than the crazy pap Lucas spewed for the next gen of teens...


but too bad most just saw the rayguns of virtuality in the 60-70-80s..; and for that we have iphones and TOS...lol

Today we have/idealize virtuality without the reality(humanism) behind those times and their ART..and experiments...-but i do see some movement as some begin to awaken from the glare of the shiny.

BTW- i was in the class of kids they "studied" -market researched the "electric company" with in 1970ish.. we got free ice cream..lol

anyhow- i hate writing all this stuff.. but theres alot to all this...

and IF the so called "experts" of meta media since 2000 dont do any real homework into the real first age of virtualization.. call it 1950-80. and the real change over years from 1980-2010... then what we get from 2010-2040, excluding natures revenge- is gonna be quite scary.

anyhow-- for some.. TV did offer "growth" via its expansion of content and ideas from the 50-80s..

im not sure it did that between 1980-2010-- i think the entire effort was a repeat, just set on "accelerate and monetize" post modern, post human methods

i wrote decades ago the problem with new media is that it never had a "modernist" period of experimentation... it went directly to a post modern process (especially interface)of implemenation.

I think that explains who leads the tech memes, and why the virtual world/ wired state is what we see today...

typing sucks.

c3

BTW-
just one more note about avatars and virtuality.

BANKSY - the MIPS and Irony of hollywoods OSCARS show, not allowing the masked "avatar" BANKSY- monkeymasked" to attend and claim the oscar(if won)in a mask.

BANKSY is just the WARHOL/KOSTABI of this decade..and of course theirs a larger art history pre electric media......

layers of virtuality...psychosis the only payback:)

c3

and of course since it sunday night....

the longest running, "bestest" considered american sitcom of all time...now longer than gunsmoke...

The Simpsons.---

"something" happened in US culture between "the flinstones" and the "simpsons".. both were prime time cartoons... both well made and funny- and contemporary for their times..... but one became relegated to kids time, and the other anchors a fully animated prime time sunday.

time for the Simpsons.:)

c3

eek. ok. last one.
TOY STORY 3-- Oscar nominated for Best Picture tonight.

so. yes theres political, economic and psychological change in how us humans look at "cartoons" and "avatars" evident in the last few decades....

beware the day when Homer Simpson says "No!";)

Prokofy Neva

I'm not sure what she meant by "failure," whether she expected the the Turkish Muslims to become German burghers and they didn't. However, I'm sorry, I'm not going to get on the PC bandwagon and pretend there is no challenge from radical islam to Europe's culture. Of course there is -- and a challenge to moderate Islam as well.

You don't have to be a booster of Pamela Geller to concede there are disturbing cases of radicalism and home-grown terrorism. I have to marvel that someone like you in Europe would think that the Londen metro bombing, the Spanish train bombing, the Moscow metro and airport bombing, that somehow these are just some sort of isolated phenomena.

You don't have to be for "kicking Islam out of Holland" to concede that there's some serious problems in radical Islam. It's that fear of political incorrectness that makes people like you unable to concede this, as if you can't carve out a political space away from Geert Wilder, as if he holds the entire space for the critique of Islam to himself.

Is Merkel, who is from the GDR, and should have perfect social democrat credentials if you will, is she really merely playing lip service? I'm not there so I don't know. But is she also finding that the social cost is high and the cultural challenge serious? And people can't discuss this without being politically incorrect?

This chasm between the views of Islam is not going to go away. It's not going to smooth out. It will grow worse.

Germany hasn't had to face the issues of the head scarves in France, the minarets of Switzerland. Let's see how it does.

Laetizia Coronet

"...pretend there is no challenge from radical islam to Europe's culture."
Oh but we're way past that point already Prok. If one thing has been a failure, it's political correctness. We know that. There's no party anymore which denies the problems associated with immigration in general and radical Islam especially.

But Wilders denies the existence of moderate Islam.

Merkel, by the way, was born in Hamburg in then West Germany - and grew up in the GDR.

Prokofy Neva

If you REALLY thought there is a problem with radical Islam, you would begin with that. You wouldn't denounce Merkel. But you don't REALLY think there is. You are only conceding it when pushed.

It doesn't matter if she was literally born in West Germany, the point is she's FROM the GDR. She grew up there and has the sensibilities of the East German communist system. This system in fact, despite all its lovely multiculturalism fashioned and delivered by the unfortunate Mr. Mikhoels and many others, produced racists. Produced insular fascist types. Imagine that. There it is. So sure, I'm quite prepared to believe Merkel is insular and racist but...I think it's probably a lot more subtle and complex than that.

Maybe if there were more moderate Islam on hand, it would be harder for Wilders to make his case. If the film maker hadn't been murdered. If there weren't so many terrorist acts. If there weren't murderous threats and violent demonstrations over the Danish cartoon. Unfortunately for your theories and your scoldings, the environment doesn't really sustain that perspective.

Why do you think in America, the Danish cartoon wasn't published? It wasn't published in major newspapers and magazines.

Answer: because while we have the First Amendment, it's predicated on a context that is in fact not about absence of religion, but not privileging one religion over another in a multi-religious setting.

So the path to peace is to recognize every religion can do its thing as long as it concedes that every other religion can do its thing and doesn't seek state power, or the ruling of the state - that the state is secular.

So in that setting, most people respect that religions have sensibilities, and you don't deliberately insult them; you show a little respect.

Not publishing the cartoon is about showing a little respect, some decency.

In Europe, the cartoon got made, and got disseminated, because there is a hatred of religion. There is a great disdain from the increasingly religionless for religion. There is a belief that when you see radical manifestations of religion, the response is to ridicule them. The response is to find something hypocritical about them and rub it in.

And that's why it's not going to get better, but worse.

Horus Vale

Prok - Whether your artistic proxie is a puppet, a cartoon or a game avatar, it all boils down the same thing. You are using an abstract construct to communicate part of who your are, how you think, and what you desire. Such an abstraction is representing a set of ideals. The result is an architype. Its not you, its an ideal reduced down to its essentials, which is why is is "flat" and can not stand up to the real thing. An avatar as a model can be a useful proxie for individual expression, but will always be smaller then the infinite nature of the physical realm entity it is trying to communicate. As such, it will always fall short of the depth one requires for conveying certain complex subjects like multiculturalism. The psyche is simply smaller than the cosmos. -Horus

Darien Caldwell

I watched Sesame Street as a kid. Electric Company too. It wasn't because I wanted to learn something. It was just cheap entertainment to a kid, and parents could feel good about letting a kid watch it. We didn't have computers, or the internet back then.

I recall I found the segments where they showed the inner workings of factories far more interesting than repeating a letter. But then I always was an above average child. :)

I also watched large amounts of Warner Bros. Cartoons, Tom and Jerry too. Works of Art.

I remember one episode even brought me to tears as a child. Tom's death scene was particularly heart-breaking. Nothing like the product-placement cartoon ads of today.

I'm not going to pretend to understand what any of that has to do with communism. *shrugs*

cube inada

unlike CGI/flash toons on the web today..... most of those cartoons were animated by union shops.....and done in the country(us) --that created a middle class livelyhood for animators for 50 years, and an industry supporting upper and lower class workers as well.

but 50 years of "mechanical people" being viewed by younger people, has created the culture of today.

just LOOK at the top grossing(most "relevant"=money= value=capitalism) 50 films....almost all of the last 20- 30 years.... and all of the top grossing within the last decade of computers///digital people. etc..type and do servants/:) are 3d cartoons.

40 years ago NASA sent out plaques with IMAGES of EARTH and MUSIC/ART etc into deep space....

Looking at our TOP media-FILMs- what would the aliens think? would they even recognize earth as anything more than a 3d virtuality cartoon.?

you think i kid... well, give it 50 years...

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