Full Text of Interview with Former Kremlin Advisor Surkov on the Prigozhin Rebellion

Reuters and other major news outlets have excerpted the interview published on Telegram and other Russian media sources today, June 26, 2023, with Vladislav Surkov, former presidential advisor:

Here is the full text of the interview by Alexander Chesnyakov of the Center for Current Politics with Surkov:

Chesnakov: How do you see the reasons and possible consequences of Prigozhin's rebellion?

Surkov: It's fashionable now in Russia to dig around in history. So here's some history for you: in 1980 in Leningrad [St. Petersburg], a woman was walking along the street. An ordinary woman. Three gopniks [low-class street thugs] jumped her. One of them came at her from behind, grabbed her by the neck and began to strangle her. He squeezed her neck until she fainted. Then the gopniks tore off her earings and -- note this! -- her boots. These beasts were then arrested and tried. The one who grabbed the woman from behind and strangled her was named Yevgeny Prigozhin. That's all you need to know about Prigozhin. Nothing more. Nothing else matters.

Of course, the rhetorical question arises: "but wait, how was he able to serve in pest control?" [A reference to the Russian satire by Mikhail Bulgakov, "Heart of a Dog," which roughly means, "But he was catching bad guys, how can he be a bad guy himself?--trans."

Fortunately, rhetorical questions do not presuppose answers.

Chesnakov: What is needed to normalize the situation?

Surkov: Lots of things. But the main thing is to secure undivided authority. And for that, we have to think seriously -- why do we need private military companies, really?

As is known, I believe Russian democracy to be sovereign. The main feature of this approach is that you cannot blindly copy foreign institutions. Some things must be borrowed; others, not. It is critically important to consider the special features of national culture and psychology in constructing a political system.

What is a private military company (PMC)? It is a direct borrowing from Western practice, or rather, from American practice. And this will be more western than any West will be. Now, talk has sprung up again about a law on PMCs [they are still not legalized in Russia--trans.]. But should an institution be legitimized, which in Russian real terms is essentially anti-Constitutional in nature? They'll pass the law, and a string of enthusiasts will be drawn to high office. And they'll persuade people to permit them to create a private army. And many will be persuaded.

How can a military detachment be private, in our understanding? This does not correspond at all to Russian political, management, and military culture. You can't have your own private nuclear station, for example, in Russia. But you can have your own private assault division? Why? "Private armies" emerged in Russia only during the Time of Troubles and the Civil War. If a law on PMCs is passed, no matter how good it is and well conceived, no matter how precisely it is drafted, that the PMCs are subordinate to army command, and are part of the army and so on, such a law will create a dangerous prospect of turning our country in the future into some sort of Eurasian "tribal zone". 

We don't need that. We have a contract system in our Armed Forces. You can make it more detailed, you can make it more flexible if needed, but don't play around with the PMCs any more.

After all, PMCs were created to take part in proxy wars. Why do we need them today, when we are openly taking part in the battle for Ukraine? This isn't a proxy war; this is a special military operation. The army must be strengthened not only with armaments, but with unity of leadership.

Do you remember why the strategic industrial branches of the USSR collapsed? They were destroyed by the law on cooperatives. At each state enterprise, numerous private cooperatives sprang up.  Profit then accrued to the cooperatives which was controlled and eaten up by the state enterprise management. But the expenditures and losses were bucked to the state. The result was bankruptcy, and the collapse of machine-building and extractive industries. How many years and how much cash was needed to restore them!

The PMC is, after all, a cooperative attached to the army! The army has to absorb all the "losses" -- both material and reputational. But the PMC gets the cash and the glory. Yes, there are many heroes among the PMC fighters. But are there really less of them among the "ordinary" paratroopers, infantry, tank drivers, and gunners?! If this is not stopped, the result will be devastating.

Chesnakov: Progozhin made the statement that the special military operation is profitable only for oligarchs?

Surkov: Right. Oligarchs like him. What is an oligarch, from the perspective of political science? It's a businessman who makes money from state purchasing orders (for example, delivering food and kamikaze soldiers for the Ministry of Defense, as Prigozhin does [a reference to Prigozhin's rounding up of prisoners and raw recruits and sending them into battle where they are killed in large numbers--trans]); who has media resources (as he has); corrupt ties with government agencies (as he has); and political ambitions (as he has). Prigozhin is an oligarch. If Berezovsky had been given a tank, he would have turned out like Prigozhin. It's profitable for him.

But the battle for Ukraine began and will end not for the sake of profit. But for the sake of victory.

Russian source is here.

Comments

[Indymarsh]

So I understood from someone who worked at Linden Lab that the account Danger Linden on Twitter actually belongs to their one-time senior director of product. Apparently his boss thought they should just deny that the account was even his in 2012 for some unclear reason, maybe because they didn't think his interactions with you went well, or as some internal joke/"prank". But he continued tweeting mundane LL stuff until 2016 and the account was subsequently acknowledged as his on LL's internal network.

[Dorothy Schaf]

Mark McCahill discusses his role in inventing the Internet and even mentions you – and his interest in the sociology of playing around with you and the woodburies in SL. (He was not really interested in or impressed with SL from a technical standpoint)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo71v4m1VRU&ab_channel=Triangulation

[Anne]

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[Prokofy Neva]

You must be a griefer yourself, Anne, if you believe that day-old alts or people with fake names like "RavenglassBot" are related to me. They are created merely to discredit me and agitate people. I don't spam anyone anywhere, least of all in any store. I occasionally message *my own* groups. I do not publish hateful propaganda anywhere; I did not vote for Trump and abhor everything about him. Perhaps people are put off by your stupidity in not bothering to check any facts whatsoever. Put your full name and your store name if you stand behind your remarks.